People Who Won't Transfer Memorials (moved from below to discussion)

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Sherry Hightower on April 7, 2010 at 10:03pm

Melissa

Your Great Grandparents fall within the hallowed 4-Genration Rule... try to email an admin and request their help. Be sure to mention the 4-Generation Rule since they are so fond of quoting it themselves.

AJ@findagrave.com is a good place to start. Be sure to ask him to forward your request to the right party if he can't help you with this.

Permalink Reply by Leeann Boone on April 19, 2010 at 11:02am

I personally haven't had any problems with findagrave. I have a memorial up for an aquantance that I knew in high school as a friend of a friend who was killed last summer and I'll gladly transfer to her family if they ask me to. I'd be more than willing to transfer the great grandparents memorials over to one of their children or grandchildren if asked. The only memorials I wont transfer are my mother(because she's my mother) and my great uncle Albert because he died when he was just over 1 yrs old,has no descendents,parents are dead,most of his siblings are dead and the ones who are not dead dont have internet or even a computer.

Permalink Reply by Allyssa on April 22, 2010 at 6:19pm

i personally don't see what the trouble is to take the 60odd secs it takes to transfer a memorial. i mean if it's noone to you and you don't have the desire to maintain it, then whats the problem giving it to someone who does.

on my own page, i put:

"If you would like to make corrections to any of my memorials, please use the Suggest Correction feature, and give me full details. If you wish to dispute my information, please provide your source, so i can verify that my information is incorrect. If you wish to add bio info to a memorial, instead of just hard facts, use the suggest feature and state clearly what you would like me to do. i will likely copy and paste it just as you write it.

If you would like me to transfer a memorial to you, please use the Suggest Correction feature for that as well. If I am not family or researching them in some way, then I will gladly do so. I DO NOT insist that you must be family to get a transfer, just that you have an interest in taking *and maintaining* responsibility for it."

that way people see that i'm willing to help them out. i'm not just in it for the numbers. but, thats just me...

Permalink Reply by Susan Jones on May 1, 2010 at 7:48pm

Hi everyone--I thought I had added something here earlier, but I must not have done it right because I can't find it! I was basically saying that one of the reasons memorials aren't being transferred much is because a lot of times when they are, they are deleted and re-entered, sometimes using the original poster's headstone photos. Most dedicated high-number contributors could do without the numbers thing, but to intentionally delete something they have worked on and steal the photo and repost as their own is wrong. I personally don't ask for transfers because I've always had good luck getting links and other information added through the SACs. It doesn't bother me to "not maintain" memorials of my family.

Permalink Reply by Dixie on May 9, 2010 at 8:15am

Most of this discussion (bashing) really ticks me off so I'm going to address all the points in this one reply. I have been on Find A Grave for a long time and remember well when transferring was not easy. It required contacting an administrator and possibly waiting months - one transfer I was doing to a relative took over 3 months. As such, requests were not asked for willy nilly as they are today.

The attitude of the members who have joined FAG in the past year or two is drastically different than those who have been on the site since before it was so popular. When I find a memorial for a relative, I am thrilled - I know I will never be able to travel to each grave site so being able to see a photo (or request one) is wonderful. The memorial contributor has my undying appreciation. I do not ask for every relative to be transferred, but instead add them to a Virtual Cemetery...or more than one. In many cases, I knew the county in which the relative died but not the name of the cemetery where the person was buried - so I have obtained information all because someone took the time and made the effort to add a memorial for a person they are not related to. Unless the memorial was for someone very special to me, I do not ask for "out of guidelines" transfers. It is enough that the memorial has been added. If I have additional information to be added, I submit it via the Suggest A Correction (another recent addition to the site). If the contributor adds it, great! If not, I'm disappointed but I do not call the contributor names such as selfish, mean-spirited or any of the other deroragory comments I've seen here. The information is on my WorldConnect and Ancestry trees, so it is available to other researchers. I can even link from my WorldConnect and Ancestry trees to the memorial. I document graves and contribute memorials for the cemeteries in my area so those who cannot travel here will have access to accurate information.

The web-site is Find a Grave. It is not Find My Family or Collect My Family. If you don't like the purpose and rules of the site, you don't have to participate. Set up your own site where you can decide the purpose and rules.

Lying about your relationship is not a good idea. (And to justify lying with "I think the Good Lord would agree" is sad...how can you call yourself a Christian when you advocate breaking a commandment and claiming God would allow it???) This behavior is childish and will do more damage to getting transfers because the contributors will become suspicious of everyone. Submitting information and demonstrating by your actions that you want to create a meaningful memorial is far more helpful than lying. You still may not get the transfer, but which is more important "controlling" the memorial or having it be a meaningful tribute?

This is not the first time I've heard something similar to 'why do you put photos on FAG if you don't want people to use them'. If there is a rocking chair on your neighbor's front porch, do you just take it without asking then justify your actions by asking the owner "If you didn't want me to use it, why did you put it out where I could see it?" Come on, people!! It's stealing (covered in another commandment). Most contributors will allow you to copy the photo and use it if only asked. They may grant permission if credit is included. Some will not grant permission to post on another web-site and that is their right as the photographer and contributor. If someone denies you permission, put on your big girl/boy pants and act like an adult: accept it graciously. Do not act like a petulant child and accuse them of being selfish. Selfish people would not post it for you to be able to see what the grave looks like. Do not copy the photo to another web-site anyway and think you'll get away with it. If you have a family tree on Ancestry, read the Terms & Conditions as well as the Content Submission Agreement; both of which say to only post what belongs to you or for which you have permission.

Find A Grave doesn't just "prefer" one memorial per person. Deliberately duplicating is against the site rules and is a bannable offense. Do you teach your children to 'play by the rules'? If so, why do you expect better behavior from your children than yourself?

Do I transfer out of guidelines? It depends on a variety of things: whether or not I am related, how I am approached, etc. I used to transfer far more readily than I do now. Over the past year, I have become more reluctant to transfer because of
a.) the newbie attitude the genealogical tertiary purpose of the site should take precedence over the primary purpose;
b.) receiving mass transfer requests ("Would you please transfer all 37 Carter's in this cemetery to me?");
c.) having been lied to about the realtionship (and catching the liar);
d.) being threatened "If you don't transfer it, I will create my own."
e.) transferring and then the memorial was deleted.
f.) been called a variety of names or accused of "having the wrong agenda".

What part have you played in that change?

If you truly are a Find A Grave Addict, you
- understand and appreciate the purposes of the site as detailed in the "What is Find A Grave"
- understand and appreciate the reasons Find A Grave was created
- are more interested in the ultimate goal of Find A Grave: "the goal is not to 'own' every memorial of those to whom you are related. The ultimate goal should be to have meaningful, accurate memorials that honor those who have passed away, regardless of who created the memorial or who maintains it."

Permalink Reply by Allyssa on May 9, 2010 at 8:34am

people really get memorials transferred then delete them and add their own? what's the purpose of that? thats kinda silly. i'm not sure what would be gained by that... people are odd

Permalink Reply by Dixie on May 9, 2010 at 8:38am

Yes, they do really get a transfer then delete the memorial. As far as I can tell, the sole purpose is to get the original contributor's name 'off' the memorial.

Permalink Reply by Patty Wimpsett Killion on May 9, 2010 at 9:07am

I think this is so rude. In genealogy I believe anyone who has helped even gain an inch to achieve your goal deserves acknowledgement.

Permalink Reply by Patty Wimpsett Killion on May 9, 2010 at 9:00am

Hi Pixie,
Thank you for your opinion of how Find A Grave should be run and how if we are Addicts how we should understand and appreciate Find A Grave.
I myself, have asked for transfers of my family members in the past and have NEVER used the above measures that you list. I did complain once because of the way "I" was treated and went to the board for this. Well, should I say I'll never go there again. They hate Newbies and are totally all for the numbers game runners. Oops, did I say that? Sorry, that's my opinion. Not allowed to have that on FAG.
Anyway, getting back to what I wanted to say. The goal of those who own in mass numbers is just that....to own in mass numbers. My goal and I believe many many other people is to have correct accurate information on the memorial pages. These people are holding their ancestors at ransom. The ransom money is their heart and then they say but you can send me the correct data information and I'll update it for you, shoot you can even send me pictures and we can put them up.
Also Pixie, perhaps if you and the others when you find these people doing these wrong things on your list would confront them and tell them why you are not transferring, you would weed them out. Right now the most impolite thing in the world these people do is ignore you. When I ask for a transfer I always give them all the information I have. It leaves a very bitter taste in my mouth when I don't even get a reply.

What part do you play in this?

Permalink Reply by Allyssa on May 9, 2010 at 10:11am

indeed there are some people on the forums who are incredibly rude to "newbies". i've been on that site for over 6 years, but i dont go to the forums that much, so i'm still a "newbie" there. but the reason i don't is because a number of the times i did go, to ask questions, etc, i encountered some people who were really nasty to me. the same people, too. nasty on a number of occasions, the same people usually too. that is just uncalled for. i have come across other people who were great, and i was grateful, but those nasty people put me off overall. i only go there when i really need to. tis a shame. :(

Permalink Reply by Dixie on May 9, 2010 at 10:11am

Patty, you said "I myself, have asked for transfers of my family members in the past and have NEVER used the above measures that you list." One of the items on my list was "been called a variety of names or accused of having the wrong agenda". You have done exactly that in nearly every message you've made in this thread:
Shame on this person and others.
I think some of these people on FAG are sooo selfish.
Please don't tell me not to condemn them for refusing to transfer to a family member.
The people that are holding my ancestor's memorial pages from me do not even have a photo of the gravestone yet and the sad thing is as long as that person holds on to my family it will not have the correct information nor the photo.
These people are holding their ancestors at ransom.

First and foremost, every contributor to Find A Grave is appreciated: whether you have contributed 1 memorial or 100,000. If someone has posted 100,000 memorials, they have put a heck of a lot of time and effort into those contributions. Many of them work in collaboration with others - one person adds the memorials, another takes photographs, a third researches. Old error-laden transcriptions are entered and the errors corrected via "community effort" whether it is the collaboration described above or SAC's received from others.

Newbies are not hated on the FAG forums. Sadly, too often a newbie comes on the forums complaining about how this or that is wrong when they (the newbie) never read the FAQ and believes the site should change to suit them, etc. Other times, the newbie comes into the fourms admitting they deliberately broke the rules (such as deliberately duplicating) but making excuses or justifying their actions. One of the most common complaints a newbie has is something wasn't done soon enough - last week there was a post accusing a long-time contributor of not responding but it turned out the complainer had not even allowed 48 hours to pass before posting the accusation! A bit over the top, in my opinion.

Do you want a reply to or acknowledgement of every SAC you send? I receive roughly 25 SACs a day (and I am far from being a big number contributor), work full-time and do a lot of volunteer work. If I do whatever the SAC asks, I do not send a reply or acknowledgement - my reply is the change made to the memorial! If I do not do what the SAC asks, I will respond to explain why I am not doing it (such as if the info is plagiarized from another site) if the person has a method to contact...those who do not have an email address listed will not get a response.

If your goal really is to have accurate info on the memorial pages and the person who contributed it adds/corrects the information, then your goal has been accomplished. Why is a transfer needed in that case? You said "The people that are holding my ancestor's memorial pages from me do not even have a photo of the gravestone yet and the sad thing is as long as that person holds on to my family it will not have the correct information nor the photo." Does that mean you will not submit the correct info or photo unless the memorial is transferred to you? If that is the case, then you are holding the info and photo hostage...

Earlier you said "allowing us to more or less create a cemetery that holds our family". You can add ANY memorial to a virtual cemetery. I have over 60 VC's - one for each family line, one for friends, one for my favorite type of marker, one for my pets, one for SAC's I've sent, one for photo requests I've made that have been fulfilled, etc.

Recently I was accused of holding 2 memorials hostage after declining to transfer a mother and daughter to the requestor because the mother was his 2nd cousin 4 times removed. I guess he hadn't noticed I have added memorials for approximately 70 people by that surname and that one of them includes "my great grandmother" in the bio...in other words, they are my relatives also.

Permalink Reply by Patty Wimpsett Killion on May 9, 2010 at 2:58pm

Pixie, Yes, I did say all of that and I do stand behind it. I do feel that I have stood behind FAG and supported it when others suggested duplication of memorial pages and such. I just truly cannot stand nor understand people when they will not transfer a viable family member. Now I know there are bad offenders on both sides. I also feel there is this great "I AM BIG...ME GOTS LOTS" attitude going on that just makes me laugh.

I just try to get who I can now and not fight with anyone over it. Life is too short. BUT, I can still have my opinion.

No Pixie, I don't expect an acknowledgement of every SAC I send. I would like to be told when someone is NOT going to transfer a memorial page over to me. Because gee, let's say that would be really nice and respectful. In all case I wait for 30 days (post on my calendar) then re-email them and then guess what? They still don't acknowledge me. Nice people. Don't you think?

As far as accurate information on the memorial pages. I would hope so. Now the people who will not transfer. You will not like this but I always have more information then them when I ask for my ancestor with the exception of a photo most times. But if they won't transfer they get no information from me. Sorry that sounds terrible of me, but they are allowed to play their game and so am I. So who's the worst person? Maybe me...who cares!!!

One more thing communication goes a long way. Maybe that gentleman didn't know you had 70 other ancestors. When you search for a person maybe that person only came up. Now that to me is sure a stretch on a 2nd cousin 4 times removed, but you could had wrote him a nice little note just stating the fact that first the surname contained your great grandmother along with 69 other ancestors....case nice and closed.

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